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	<title>Comments on: Does China Turn You Into a Jerk?</title>
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		<title>By: 大陆人粗鲁吗？ &#171; 我的新家</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-140919</link>
		<dc:creator>大陆人粗鲁吗？ &#171; 我的新家</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Aug 2011 08:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] Does China Turn You Into a Jerk? ,&#8221;You’re a Stranger, You Don’t Matter&#8221; 没意识到人家会说这条！ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Does China Turn You Into a Jerk? ,&#8221;You’re a Stranger, You Don’t Matter&#8221; 没意识到人家会说这条！ [...]</p>
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		<title>By: samuel welsh</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-138062</link>
		<dc:creator>samuel welsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Aug 2011 01:24:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>chinese need to learn and demostrate good manners in all feilds
/areas to gain back respect acting like a jerk just makes enemies not friends.
good chinese surely understand that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>chinese need to learn and demostrate good manners in all feilds<br />
/areas to gain back respect acting like a jerk just makes enemies not friends.<br />
good chinese surely understand that.</p>
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		<title>By: John Anzac</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-129139</link>
		<dc:creator>John Anzac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jul 2011 07:10:38 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Its been two years and now I am getting peed off.
I have lived in Shanghai for two years and I love the Traditional culture, the food, and most of the people I have come in contact with.
I am a teacher and I love my work here,I know it is appreciated.Most of the Cultural Oddities that people have mentioned are to be expected,it has evolved, often out of neccessity.
But what I find annoying is the disregard that many show to LAWS and Regulations.Authorities are trying to modernize and educate the people to a more internationally accepted standard of behaviour.Especially considering China&#039;s hugely increased international importance,economically.
But many just ignore the rules.
I have come within inches of being struck by vehicles whilst trying to cross the street(when the little man was green);but I stand my ground and stare them down pointing to the green pedestrian light.
I have stopped the elevator door from closing until the cigerate was disposed of.
I have pulled people who were trying to cut in,aside and showed them the back of the line.
I have stopped people from pushing into the elevator,until those exiting have done so.
Others have said they have been told to put up with it.To put up with it is to accept it.Others have questioned what are we doing about it;I am taking ACTION. If we don&#039;t show them that we object, then they will continue doing it.I have often found that they will back down;because they know you are right.
We must take an active role in trying to help re-educate SOME of the older generation and some of the younger generation who have been misled.
Having said all this I will reiterate that I do love living here,the people the food the History etc.
But we need to help,and sometimes that help has to be a little more IN YOUR FACE for them to get the message.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its been two years and now I am getting peed off.<br />
I have lived in Shanghai for two years and I love the Traditional culture, the food, and most of the people I have come in contact with.<br />
I am a teacher and I love my work here,I know it is appreciated.Most of the Cultural Oddities that people have mentioned are to be expected,it has evolved, often out of neccessity.<br />
But what I find annoying is the disregard that many show to LAWS and Regulations.Authorities are trying to modernize and educate the people to a more internationally accepted standard of behaviour.Especially considering China&#8217;s hugely increased international importance,economically.<br />
But many just ignore the rules.<br />
I have come within inches of being struck by vehicles whilst trying to cross the street(when the little man was green);but I stand my ground and stare them down pointing to the green pedestrian light.<br />
I have stopped the elevator door from closing until the cigerate was disposed of.<br />
I have pulled people who were trying to cut in,aside and showed them the back of the line.<br />
I have stopped people from pushing into the elevator,until those exiting have done so.<br />
Others have said they have been told to put up with it.To put up with it is to accept it.Others have questioned what are we doing about it;I am taking ACTION. If we don&#8217;t show them that we object, then they will continue doing it.I have often found that they will back down;because they know you are right.<br />
We must take an active role in trying to help re-educate SOME of the older generation and some of the younger generation who have been misled.<br />
Having said all this I will reiterate that I do love living here,the people the food the History etc.<br />
But we need to help,and sometimes that help has to be a little more IN YOUR FACE for them to get the message.</p>
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		<title>By: Lao Lao Wai</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-102213</link>
		<dc:creator>Lao Lao Wai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 May 2011 09:26:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/#comment-102213</guid>
		<description>Oh, and one more:

An old Beijing friend of mine once said: &quot;If only 1% of people are a bit of a prick, can you imagine how many we have here in China??&quot;

Power of numbers, people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and one more:</p>
<p>An old Beijing friend of mine once said: &#8220;If only 1% of people are a bit of a prick, can you imagine how many we have here in China??&#8221;</p>
<p>Power of numbers, people.</p>
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		<title>By: Lao Lao Wai</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-102212</link>
		<dc:creator>Lao Lao Wai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 May 2011 09:23:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/#comment-102212</guid>
		<description>Love this thread and I am happy to see the absence of swearing or making it political.

I have been living in China for 12 years. Used to live in Beijing, now in Shanghai. I was a student before, have had all sorts of jobs and have been to 90% of the provinces. I have worked with a range of people, both local and imported. Ate all sorts of foods. Read, write and speak the language (Mandarin, that is). Been a best man at weddings. Engaged to a lovely Beijing girl. Have had problems with the police. And have seen the changes (most of them for the better) in Beijing and Shanghai over the years. In other words, I have been around. Having said that, the more I am here, the more I find out how little I understand.

I know I have adopted some rude behaviour as well - even though I do it with a smile (always works here). When in Rome, right? Psychologically it is normal to take on the behaviours of your surroundings: it&#039;s called social proofing. A basic phenomenon for survival where you match others.

Now, to spice up the conversation, here are some things to consider and I would love to hear back:

1. When we have been in Shanghai for 7 months, is it fair to generalise by saying &quot;the Chinese&quot;? Isn&#039;t that as ignorant as talking about &quot;Westerners&quot;? Asians are not only Chinese, and Westerners are not only from the U.S.
2. What is rude behaviour really? I probably classify &quot;rude&quot; and &quot;civilised&quot; similarly to the respondents in this thread, but we all know what is normal here, can be rude somewhere else.
3. Seek first to understand: are we really trying to understand behaviour? Because once you understand it (or at least a little bit) you begin to empathise. You don&#039;t have to agree with it, but it will change your perception of the world and make it a bit more livable.

I choose to live here, however good or bad it gets. I have a passport and have the luxury of choice to live somewhere else. What would you say if your foreign neighbour bitches about the place you live in every day? After a few days, you&#039;d probably say &quot;sod off then&quot;.

:-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Love this thread and I am happy to see the absence of swearing or making it political.</p>
<p>I have been living in China for 12 years. Used to live in Beijing, now in Shanghai. I was a student before, have had all sorts of jobs and have been to 90% of the provinces. I have worked with a range of people, both local and imported. Ate all sorts of foods. Read, write and speak the language (Mandarin, that is). Been a best man at weddings. Engaged to a lovely Beijing girl. Have had problems with the police. And have seen the changes (most of them for the better) in Beijing and Shanghai over the years. In other words, I have been around. Having said that, the more I am here, the more I find out how little I understand.</p>
<p>I know I have adopted some rude behaviour as well &#8211; even though I do it with a smile (always works here). When in Rome, right? Psychologically it is normal to take on the behaviours of your surroundings: it&#8217;s called social proofing. A basic phenomenon for survival where you match others.</p>
<p>Now, to spice up the conversation, here are some things to consider and I would love to hear back:</p>
<p>1. When we have been in Shanghai for 7 months, is it fair to generalise by saying &#8220;the Chinese&#8221;? Isn&#8217;t that as ignorant as talking about &#8220;Westerners&#8221;? Asians are not only Chinese, and Westerners are not only from the U.S.<br />
2. What is rude behaviour really? I probably classify &#8220;rude&#8221; and &#8220;civilised&#8221; similarly to the respondents in this thread, but we all know what is normal here, can be rude somewhere else.<br />
3. Seek first to understand: are we really trying to understand behaviour? Because once you understand it (or at least a little bit) you begin to empathise. You don&#8217;t have to agree with it, but it will change your perception of the world and make it a bit more livable.</p>
<p>I choose to live here, however good or bad it gets. I have a passport and have the luxury of choice to live somewhere else. What would you say if your foreign neighbour bitches about the place you live in every day? After a few days, you&#8217;d probably say &#8220;sod off then&#8221;.</p>
<p> <img src='http://www.thechinaexpat.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Mr Cups</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-91536</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr Cups</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Apr 2011 08:38:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;ve been here for almost 7 months now.  Old ladies clearing their throats and spitting used to give me the willies.  Now I could care less. I live in Shanghai and I&#039;m the only laowai in my neighborhood.  I think it&#039;s funny that they stare at me.  It&#039;s kind of like being famous or something.  When in Rome do as the romans do.  They are not being rude, that&#039;s just the culture.  I laugh whenever I see a 1 year old taking a crap on the sidewalk.  The worst is at KFC or getting on the bus.  There are no lines to get in and little old ladies will cut you off. Watch out for them coming in on your right or left and move appropriately to stop them.  They won&#039;t mind. :)  What a great country. Just don&#039;t plan on using your new habits when you go back to your home country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been here for almost 7 months now.  Old ladies clearing their throats and spitting used to give me the willies.  Now I could care less. I live in Shanghai and I&#8217;m the only laowai in my neighborhood.  I think it&#8217;s funny that they stare at me.  It&#8217;s kind of like being famous or something.  When in Rome do as the romans do.  They are not being rude, that&#8217;s just the culture.  I laugh whenever I see a 1 year old taking a crap on the sidewalk.  The worst is at KFC or getting on the bus.  There are no lines to get in and little old ladies will cut you off. Watch out for them coming in on your right or left and move appropriately to stop them.  They won&#8217;t mind. <img src='http://www.thechinaexpat.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   What a great country. Just don&#8217;t plan on using your new habits when you go back to your home country.</p>
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		<title>By: Hank Strange</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-90483</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank Strange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:01:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/#comment-90483</guid>
		<description>You don&#039;t need to go to China to see this behavior. I live in a city that has an influx of Chinese and even though they are much more under control than those described here, the whole thing fits. We tend to take the whole valuing the neighbor thing for granted and this is simply not in their culture. That said, having a rough go of it makes you more of a predator. I see it in myself the few instances of being acutally hungry etc. So it is a combination of wealth (we have the luxury of giving a shit about the rain forests, good conduct etc.) and the judeo-christain (dare I add muslum?) idea of being a good neighbor. In Somalia, if you leave your house for more that 10 minutes, the neighbors loot the place! Additionaly, within a family, politenes is seen as lacking closeness or so I am told. (Salt!, not please pass the salt.) Really we cannot judge them unless we have been through the same circumstances. That does not mean that we need to be doormats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You don&#8217;t need to go to China to see this behavior. I live in a city that has an influx of Chinese and even though they are much more under control than those described here, the whole thing fits. We tend to take the whole valuing the neighbor thing for granted and this is simply not in their culture. That said, having a rough go of it makes you more of a predator. I see it in myself the few instances of being acutally hungry etc. So it is a combination of wealth (we have the luxury of giving a shit about the rain forests, good conduct etc.) and the judeo-christain (dare I add muslum?) idea of being a good neighbor. In Somalia, if you leave your house for more that 10 minutes, the neighbors loot the place! Additionaly, within a family, politenes is seen as lacking closeness or so I am told. (Salt!, not please pass the salt.) Really we cannot judge them unless we have been through the same circumstances. That does not mean that we need to be doormats.</p>
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		<title>By: Oscillator</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-82315</link>
		<dc:creator>Oscillator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 05:52:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/#comment-82315</guid>
		<description>The rude thing I don&#039;t do causes the rude thing I do.  Let me explain.

The splashing of human DNA all over the place willy nilly-it drives me crazy! The spitting...Oh the spitting.  No matter how long I live here I will never assimilate to this particular practice.  It&#039;s a bio-hazard!  You can get hepatitis and a whole host of things from coming into contact with saliva.  It&#039;s just bad social living.  It&#039;s like a basic animal instinct not to poop, pee, spit, or otherwise secrete where you live.  Even dogs don&#039;t pee and poo where they play and live.  I saw an 8 year old pooping next to a trash can outside a mall in the city center the other day!  Don&#039;t malls have toilets...?

When I first arrived in China I tried to be zen about it.  I told myself I was a relativist, that I didn&#039;t have to go around expecting other people to live the same way, that I could dig that culture is a powerful and arbitrary force.  

Over time that zen has given way to the worst kind of open judgment sometimes bordering on harassment on my part.  I&#039;ve become more than a jerk about spitters, poopers, what have you.  I can&#039;t hide my disgust any more, even though I try, even though I want to.  I find myself openly letting out groans of disgust and giving deliberate full eye contact death stares at people who spit phlegm on the street.  I mean, it&#039;s at passive intimidation levels, especially when they do it near my house or in my neighborhood.

The thing is, I know rationally that it&#039;s so rude on my part to judge in this way and to make my judgment so aggressive and clear, but it&#039;s like this involuntary tick.  Before I know it I&#039;ve let out a venomous &quot;uuuuuugh&quot; sound and made the &quot;wtf?&quot; body position.  I feel really bad about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The rude thing I don&#8217;t do causes the rude thing I do.  Let me explain.</p>
<p>The splashing of human DNA all over the place willy nilly-it drives me crazy! The spitting&#8230;Oh the spitting.  No matter how long I live here I will never assimilate to this particular practice.  It&#8217;s a bio-hazard!  You can get hepatitis and a whole host of things from coming into contact with saliva.  It&#8217;s just bad social living.  It&#8217;s like a basic animal instinct not to poop, pee, spit, or otherwise secrete where you live.  Even dogs don&#8217;t pee and poo where they play and live.  I saw an 8 year old pooping next to a trash can outside a mall in the city center the other day!  Don&#8217;t malls have toilets&#8230;?</p>
<p>When I first arrived in China I tried to be zen about it.  I told myself I was a relativist, that I didn&#8217;t have to go around expecting other people to live the same way, that I could dig that culture is a powerful and arbitrary force.  </p>
<p>Over time that zen has given way to the worst kind of open judgment sometimes bordering on harassment on my part.  I&#8217;ve become more than a jerk about spitters, poopers, what have you.  I can&#8217;t hide my disgust any more, even though I try, even though I want to.  I find myself openly letting out groans of disgust and giving deliberate full eye contact death stares at people who spit phlegm on the street.  I mean, it&#8217;s at passive intimidation levels, especially when they do it near my house or in my neighborhood.</p>
<p>The thing is, I know rationally that it&#8217;s so rude on my part to judge in this way and to make my judgment so aggressive and clear, but it&#8217;s like this involuntary tick.  Before I know it I&#8217;ve let out a venomous &#8220;uuuuuugh&#8221; sound and made the &#8220;wtf?&#8221; body position.  I feel really bad about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-68387</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jan 2011 04:47:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/#comment-68387</guid>
		<description>It is not rudeness, they are just lack of courtesy as sweettawker said. I also want to add that China has been scares of resources. Yes we were poor when Qing collapsed and civil wars followed, but I would argue that China is also poor during Qing dynasty for at lest 200 years. All the years with scares of resources will train people to have animalistic instinct, such as &quot;never line up&quot; because if you wait you wont get anything. Also HOARDING food, clothes,containers and materials that seems to be garbage to modern people are treasures in their eyes, and they can put them into use. &quot;Free stuff!&quot; mentality (ie: I must get it because it&#039;s free. if I don&#039;t get it other people will get it too. it is my loss if I don&#039;t get it because everyone is getting it.) &quot;Fix it!&quot; Every thing can be fixed by yourself. that includes all furnitures clothes, simple electronics such as fans, radio, cooker. Fix everything that are fixable, don&#039;t buy new. Buying cost money!!. poor people are also power sensitive, they are afraid if you&#039;re powerful and mad. They will apologize and go into &quot;whatever you said&quot; mode. However if they figure out they are more powerful then you, they will take advantage of you. if you don&#039;t make a sound, they&#039;ll try again. now you&#039;re furious, well, they apologized and play nice. 
I believed that the concept of equality have little role in China, because people belittle others when possible, and others belittle them when possible. Power comes from strength, wealth, network(family and friends), background and particularly 勢（shi) (atmospheric momentum). Chinese people are highly shi-sensitive. They know when to escape when shi is not on their side. People are also gearing towards the side who has greater shi, so they can feel powerful for a moment. All these mechanism, although are part of human nature, do not lead to equality, respect and freedom which are considered &quot;modern&quot; today.these mechanism are called bullying and survival. Who knows, maybe bullying were once considered to be desirable in human history and those who master this skill got to survive. Modern people would never understand how it works.

Ironically Chinese wants to label themselves as civilized,modern and advance, while keeping all the principles that are different from the western standards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is not rudeness, they are just lack of courtesy as sweettawker said. I also want to add that China has been scares of resources. Yes we were poor when Qing collapsed and civil wars followed, but I would argue that China is also poor during Qing dynasty for at lest 200 years. All the years with scares of resources will train people to have animalistic instinct, such as &#8220;never line up&#8221; because if you wait you wont get anything. Also HOARDING food, clothes,containers and materials that seems to be garbage to modern people are treasures in their eyes, and they can put them into use. &#8220;Free stuff!&#8221; mentality (ie: I must get it because it&#8217;s free. if I don&#8217;t get it other people will get it too. it is my loss if I don&#8217;t get it because everyone is getting it.) &#8220;Fix it!&#8221; Every thing can be fixed by yourself. that includes all furnitures clothes, simple electronics such as fans, radio, cooker. Fix everything that are fixable, don&#8217;t buy new. Buying cost money!!. poor people are also power sensitive, they are afraid if you&#8217;re powerful and mad. They will apologize and go into &#8220;whatever you said&#8221; mode. However if they figure out they are more powerful then you, they will take advantage of you. if you don&#8217;t make a sound, they&#8217;ll try again. now you&#8217;re furious, well, they apologized and play nice.<br />
I believed that the concept of equality have little role in China, because people belittle others when possible, and others belittle them when possible. Power comes from strength, wealth, network(family and friends), background and particularly 勢（shi) (atmospheric momentum). Chinese people are highly shi-sensitive. They know when to escape when shi is not on their side. People are also gearing towards the side who has greater shi, so they can feel powerful for a moment. All these mechanism, although are part of human nature, do not lead to equality, respect and freedom which are considered &#8220;modern&#8221; today.these mechanism are called bullying and survival. Who knows, maybe bullying were once considered to be desirable in human history and those who master this skill got to survive. Modern people would never understand how it works.</p>
<p>Ironically Chinese wants to label themselves as civilized,modern and advance, while keeping all the principles that are different from the western standards.</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thechinaexpat.com/does-china-turn-you-into-a-jerk/comment-page-1/#comment-64277</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Dec 2010 09:56:38 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I didn&#039;t see it mentioned here but I do know that one reason Asia is seemingly unkind to westerners is that they understandably dislike the west&#039;s common superstition that they will burn in hell for eternity because they aren&#039;t christian. I applaud them for that. I know from living in thailand that here they are far, far kinder, polite and honest than westerners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t see it mentioned here but I do know that one reason Asia is seemingly unkind to westerners is that they understandably dislike the west&#8217;s common superstition that they will burn in hell for eternity because they aren&#8217;t christian. I applaud them for that. I know from living in thailand that here they are far, far kinder, polite and honest than westerners.</p>
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